ESB Strike ?

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21 Nov 2013 20:00 #1 by christyg (Chris Geraghty)
With the prospect of the impoverished ESB workers going on strike and the possibility of power cuts ahead, I thought it might be an idea to invite advice or tips on how to keep our tanks and fish safe during cuts. Better to be prepared.

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21 Nov 2013 20:07 #2 by Gonefishy (Brian oneill)
Great topic Christy...looking forward to seeing some useful posts...to kick it off, if power is gone for a prolonged time you can wrap a duvet around your tank to delay heat loss and chilling of your water.....

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21 Nov 2013 20:17 #3 by mossy (gavin blanchfield)
buy a small generator and extension lead for back up

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21 Nov 2013 20:49 #4 by igmillichip (ian millichip)
If the cuts are scheduled, then do a few partial water changes a day before.

ian

Irish Tropical Fish Society (ITFS) Member.

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21 Nov 2013 23:06 #5 by dannyb (Daniel Byrne)
Replied by dannyb (Daniel Byrne) on topic ESB Strike ?
Any info on the strikes, first I seen of it so would like to keep an eye on it

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21 Nov 2013 23:53 #6 by Stem12 (Stephen M)
Replied by Stem12 (Stephen M) on topic ESB Strike ?
again great topic, Id love to know some solutions, I had a power cut for 1 hour a few weeks back and I nearly went mad!! I was freaking out!!

SM

Juwel Vision 260-
20ltr-Fluval Spec-
19ltr-Fluval Chi-

Keep The Water Fresh-

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22 Nov 2013 09:54 #7 by hammie (Neil Hammerton)
I believe that these strikes should be averted, I know companies are playing hard ball with the work force, however they should not and I believe will not be allowed to push Ireland into the stone age over a few quid!!!
Anyway, duvets round tanks and stirofoam lids or stirofoam wrapped round the tank will be a serious benefit. Also as Ian said, I would definitely do a partial water change before hand to ensure filtration isnt as big an issue

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24 Nov 2013 16:14 - 24 Nov 2013 16:16 #8 by JohnH (John)
Replied by JohnH (John) on topic ESB Strike ?
I'm really surprised that Christy's post didn't result in a flood of replies - by making this reply brings it back to the fore, but perhaps we're all expecting these strikes won't ever happen (I certainly hope that proves to be the case).

For myself I have a small two-stroke generator which I bought from a good friend when he was leaving to emigrate to Canada (reminder to myself to get some petroil in the week - just in case). This will be merely for power to keep the filtration running = water takes a long time to heat up and also to lose temperature as well so my prime concern will be to keep the bacteria 'active'.
Quite a good investment is a battery-powered air pump, these will run for a good few hours on fresh batteries and can be used to save any air-driven filtration bacteria. Obviously if you have more than a couple of tanks this mightn't prove to be feasible, but worth considering nonetheless. Let's all just hope that good sense prevails.

I'm waiting to hear - if they do go ahead - more details of power cuts, especially duration and timing.

But it really is in all our interests to at least think about what may happen and to make (even if only mentally) contingency plans.

Out here in the middle of nowhere power outages are doubly harmful, I rely upon it for my water supply (from the well) too.

It's funny, really, how we are so blase about these things - but in all honesty life out here grounds to a halt every time the lightning strikes a power line, or - when it's windy - a tree is blown onto cables and damages them and - as happened here recently - a farmer broke an underground cable when opening a new ditch with his JCB! Like our cars, we take it for granted and only really notice when it/they aren't working!

John

Location:
N. Tipp

We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl - year after year.


ITFS member.



It's a long way to Tipperary.
Last edit: 24 Nov 2013 16:16 by JohnH (John). Reason: missing words

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25 Nov 2013 13:24 #9 by anglecichlid (ciaran hogan)
I can tell you if they do strike I'm fecked
The shed is warm even now while it's cold
But that's down to two things
1,there's a rad in there and
2,the warm humid air from the heat of the tanks
Now if we lose power,I have nether
And that leaves me with two options
Buy a generator(not feasible with the Santa fella on the way)
Or bring all my stock to someone who has a generator
Is there any way of getting a petition together,
Getting everyone here to sign it and send it on to the powers that be?
Based on the fact that there's going to be a massive strain on the fish keeping
Community and there's a good chance that people like myself are going to lose out on a lot of hard work!

Anyone with a aquarium can keep fish,
But it takes real skill to be a fish keeper,


And it's spongeBob,
SpongeBob lives in a pineapple under the sea
BLANCHARDSTOWN

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25 Nov 2013 13:41 #10 by JohnH (John)
Replied by JohnH (John) on topic ESB Strike ?
I just found this site - but it seems to be US-oriented.

www.thepetitionsite.com/

Maybe someone here understands these things better and can get something organised?

John

Location:
N. Tipp

We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl - year after year.


ITFS member.



It's a long way to Tipperary.

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25 Nov 2013 17:42 #11 by igmillichip (ian millichip)
Car innertubes (for powering air-powered filters).

I suppose having experienced pretty hefty power-cuts with fish tanks in the 70s in the UK during winter does help give a few ideas of what to expect.

ian

Irish Tropical Fish Society (ITFS) Member.

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25 Nov 2013 18:24 #12 by anglecichlid (ciaran hogan)
Good thinking batman
Would a canister of compressed oxygen do also?

Anyone with a aquarium can keep fish,
But it takes real skill to be a fish keeper,


And it's spongeBob,
SpongeBob lives in a pineapple under the sea
BLANCHARDSTOWN

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25 Nov 2013 19:16 #13 by igmillichip (ian millichip)

anglecichlid wrote: Good thinking batman
Would a canister of compressed oxygen do also?


I probably wouldn't recommend the compressed oxygen on safety grounds......and the oxygen saturation in the water afterwarsd may be just too much for the fish.

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25 Nov 2013 20:05 #14 by bmcg38 (Brian McGrath)
Replied by bmcg38 (Brian McGrath) on topic ESB Strike ?
there is no way they will strike .. its all hot air

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25 Nov 2013 22:21 #15 by Melander (Andreas Melander)

bmcg38 wrote: there is no way they will strike .. its all hot air


Agreed, I cannot see this happening in a modern society and that's probably why there has not been more interest in the post.

The thread is however a very good reminder to get prepared, there could be a power cut from natural causes anytime. Like John pointed out it might be even more relevant out in the countryside.

I have wanted to get a backup plan for a long time now anyway, either a generator or plenty of those battery driver air pumps, can't decide. I'm not too worried about the heat loss as I can't see a power cut last that long.

Andreas

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25 Nov 2013 23:04 #16 by LemonJelly (Johnny Cowley)

Melander wrote:

bmcg38 wrote: there is no way they will strike .. its all hot air


Agreed, I cannot see this happening in a modern society and that's probably why there has not been more interest in the post.

The thread is however a very good reminder to get prepared, there could be a power cut from natural causes anytime. Like John pointed out it might be even more relevant out in the countryside.

I have wanted to get a backup plan for a long time now anyway, either a generator or plenty of those battery driver air pumps, can't decide. I'm not too worried about the heat loss as I can't see a power cut last that long.

Andreas


from what I've heard from several sources, sponge filters seem to last especially well in the event of a powercut; unlike, for example, an external filter

"The only thing that burns in Hell is the part of you that won't let go of your life; your memories, your attachments. They burn them all away. But they're not punishing you.They're freeing your soul."

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26 Nov 2013 11:14 #17 by Melander (Andreas Melander)

LemonJelly wrote:

Melander wrote:

bmcg38 wrote: there is no way they will strike .. its all hot air


Agreed, I cannot see this happening in a modern society and that's probably why there has not been more interest in the post.

The thread is however a very good reminder to get prepared, there could be a power cut from natural causes anytime. Like John pointed out it might be even more relevant out in the countryside.

I have wanted to get a backup plan for a long time now anyway, either a generator or plenty of those battery driver air pumps, can't decide. I'm not too worried about the heat loss as I can't see a power cut last that long.

Andreas


from what I've heard from several sources, sponge filters seem to last especially well in the event of a powercut; unlike, for example, an external filter


Good point, +1 for the generator then.

Andreas

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26 Nov 2013 11:49 #18 by LemonJelly (Johnny Cowley)

Melander wrote:

LemonJelly wrote:

Melander wrote:

bmcg38 wrote: there is no way they will strike .. its all hot air


Agreed, I cannot see this happening in a modern society and that's probably why there has not been more interest in the post.

The thread is however a very good reminder to get prepared, there could be a power cut from natural causes anytime. Like John pointed out it might be even more relevant out in the countryside.

I have wanted to get a backup plan for a long time now anyway, either a generator or plenty of those battery driver air pumps, can't decide. I'm not too worried about the heat loss as I can't see a power cut last that long.

Andreas


from what I've heard from several sources, sponge filters seem to last especially well in the event of a powercut; unlike, for example, an external filter


Good point, +1 for the generator then.

Andreas


Actually they even last pretty well in the absence of any air flow at all. Unlike an external filter, where once the power stops your bacterial colony is cut off totally from its food supply (and so can only last a few hours), a sponge filter is still sitting in a larger body of water and at least has some access to sustenance.

Sponge filters rule :cool:

"The only thing that burns in Hell is the part of you that won't let go of your life; your memories, your attachments. They burn them all away. But they're not punishing you.They're freeing your soul."

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26 Nov 2013 18:56 #19 by igmillichip (ian millichip)
This is where a truly mature tank will come into its own and decreases risks.

Mature does not mean "old"......it's a bit like vintage port: it is vintage the day it is picked; it is only a good wine that get better with age; a poor wine get worse with age. ;)

Recently set-up tanks (eg ones under a year old or ones not set-up fully), though, are most at risk from failed filtration during a power-cut.

ian

Irish Tropical Fish Society (ITFS) Member.

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27 Nov 2013 00:20 #20 by platty252 (Darren Dalton)
I believe they will strike. This has been going on the past 2 years with no out come so far.
I think the 13/14th Dec. is the earliest they can strike.

For heat you can wrap the tank as suggested. But you can also get heat packs in camping shops. Place them in side a deflated and tied fish bag and put at the bottom of the tank.

To keep filter bacteria alive from internal or external filters get a large lunch box. Drill some 5mm holes in the sides and drill some holes across the top.
Place the filter media in side and place some air line in to one of the 5mm hole in the side.
Stand the box up right in the tank. Connect the air line to a battery air pump (available at some LFS).
This will keep some of the filter alive and add oxygen to the tank.

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27 Nov 2013 10:42 #21 by JohnH (John)
Replied by JohnH (John) on topic ESB Strike ?

LemonJelly wrote:

Melander wrote:

LemonJelly wrote:

Melander wrote:

bmcg38 wrote: there is no way they will strike .. its all hot air


Agreed, I cannot see this happening in a modern society and that's probably why there has not been more interest in the post.

The thread is however a very good reminder to get prepared, there could be a power cut from natural causes anytime. Like John pointed out it might be even more relevant out in the countryside.

I have wanted to get a backup plan for a long time now anyway, either a generator or plenty of those battery driver air pumps, can't decide. I'm not too worried about the heat loss as I can't see a power cut last that long.

Andreas


from what I've heard from several sources, sponge filters seem to last especially well in the event of a powercut; unlike, for example, an external filter


Good point, +1 for the generator then.

Andreas


Actually they even last pretty well in the absence of any air flow at all. Unlike an external filter, where once the power stops your bacterial colony is cut off totally from its food supply (and so can only last a few hours), a sponge filter is still sitting in a larger body of water and at least has some access to sustenance.

Sponge filters rule :cool:


LJ,
As I understand it (and I'm perfectly open to being corrected if I'm wrong) your last observation is missing the point somewhat.
In our filtration systems there are two types of bacteria, aerobic and anaerobic - one of which needs oxygen and one which doesn't (don't ask me which is which though, although I do think it's the former).
So, without the oxygen the one which depends upon it will quickly die off and this will break the whole chain.
Perhaps IGM could tell us more when he has the time.
John

Location:
N. Tipp

We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl - year after year.


ITFS member.



It's a long way to Tipperary.

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27 Nov 2013 11:44 #22 by LemonJelly (Johnny Cowley)

JohnH wrote:

LemonJelly wrote:

Melander wrote:

LemonJelly wrote:

Melander wrote:

bmcg38 wrote: there is no way they will strike .. its all hot air


Agreed, I cannot see this happening in a modern society and that's probably why there has not been more interest in the post.

The thread is however a very good reminder to get prepared, there could be a power cut from natural causes anytime. Like John pointed out it might be even more relevant out in the countryside.

I have wanted to get a backup plan for a long time now anyway, either a generator or plenty of those battery driver air pumps, can't decide. I'm not too worried about the heat loss as I can't see a power cut last that long.

Andreas


from what I've heard from several sources, sponge filters seem to last especially well in the event of a powercut; unlike, for example, an external filter


Good point, +1 for the generator then.

Andreas


Actually they even last pretty well in the absence of any air flow at all. Unlike an external filter, where once the power stops your bacterial colony is cut off totally from its food supply (and so can only last a few hours), a sponge filter is still sitting in a larger body of water and at least has some access to sustenance.

Sponge filters rule :cool:


LJ,
As I understand it (and I'm perfectly open to being corrected if I'm wrong) your last observation is missing the point somewhat.
In our filtration systems there are two types of bacteria, aerobic and anaerobic - one of which needs oxygen and one which doesn't (don't ask me which is which though, although I do think it's the former).
So, without the oxygen the one which depends upon it will quickly die off and this will break the whole chain.
Perhaps IGM could tell us more when he has the time.
John


I get what you're saying. I'm not saying they don't need oxygen; but a sponge sitting directly in a tank will survive longer than an external, which is more or less starved of oxygen/nourishment from the moment the power fails. And it then pumps all that toxic water back into the tank once the power comes back. But if the tank becomes depleted of O2, then yeah, you're screwed... and not in a good way! :pinch:

"The only thing that burns in Hell is the part of you that won't let go of your life; your memories, your attachments. They burn them all away. But they're not punishing you.They're freeing your soul."

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27 Nov 2013 16:25 #23 by igmillichip (ian millichip)
When it comes to the oxygen needs of bacteria, it isn't quite as simple as aerobic vs anaerobic bacteria.

If you have obligate (strict) aerobic bacteria then they demand oxygen; obligate anearobes are gonna die in the presence of oxygen (well..usually), but there are facultative anaerobic bacteria that will live with or without oxtgenb (I won't go into the full definitions here though).

In the fish tank you will obligate aerobes, obligate anaerobes, facultative anaerobes all in various amounts and activities and doing all sorts of different things.

It is not just the question of a process stopping but that a process may start to reverse itself under anoxic conditions that is of concern...eg reduction of nitrates to nitrites and reduction of nitrites to form ammonia !!!

Denitrifying bacteria are actually aerobic bacteria living under anaerobic (anoxic) conditions.....they are not anaerobic.

A very important group of bacteria are the anaerobic oxidising bacteria that oxidise ammonia to form nitrogen gas.....but these are slow to grow and are unlikely to exist in immature tanks.

ian

Irish Tropical Fish Society (ITFS) Member.

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27 Nov 2013 19:14 - 27 Nov 2013 19:15 #24 by JohnH (John)
Replied by JohnH (John) on topic ESB Strike ?
Well, that's cleared it up - I think...

:unsure: :unsure: :unsure: :unsure:

John :-(

:evil: :whistle:

Location:
N. Tipp

We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl - year after year.


ITFS member.



It's a long way to Tipperary.
Last edit: 27 Nov 2013 19:15 by JohnH (John). Reason: No reason, really

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27 Nov 2013 19:30 #25 by ger310 (Ger .)
Replied by ger310 (Ger .) on topic ESB Strike ?

JohnH wrote: Well, that's cleared it up - I think...

:unsure: :unsure: :unsure: :unsure:

John :-(

:evil: :whistle:


And that was the simple explanation ha

Ger

What do you call a three legged Donkey?

A Wonkey....duh ha :)

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11 Dec 2015 23:20 #26 by robert (robert carter)
Replied by robert (robert carter) on topic ESB Strike ?
I know this is an old thread but aldi and LidI have small 800watt generators from time to time for around 89 euro . These are great ,not enough power to boil a Kettle for but more to the point will run a couple of heaters and filter . But be warning these are two stroke and can be hard to start if no used for a while

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