Iwagumi (scrapped). 30L nano (start)

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25 Nov 2013 08:22 #61 by Lauris (Lauris)
&..

Lauris wrote:

platty252 wrote: Just one more thing Lauris, don't panic. It will be fine.

Darren.


Thank you!


I'm still calm! :laugh:

I am planted!

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25 Nov 2013 16:50 #62 by Lauris (Lauris)
The second issue looks like very the same you described Darren. Is there anything I might be
able to do to not lose everything? I carried out
another water change today for about 70%. Should
increase the lights to let the plants uptake the nutrients? Or just keep changing the water and
hope for the best?

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25 Nov 2013 17:48 #63 by Lauris (Lauris)
ok. this looks like a disaster to me... Is anything I can do without loosing all of the plants?
It looks very like they are turning worse with every day

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25 Nov 2013 17:49 #64 by Lauris (Lauris)
hmm,, and what's wrong with this my topic? I don't see any posts after successfully posted something?

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25 Nov 2013 17:49 - 25 Nov 2013 17:51 #65 by Lauris (Lauris)
ok, it's fine now! it looks like it was stuck for my profile to display the 3rd page.
some pics will come in 30min. kinda sad to see them melting and passing away.

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Last edit: 25 Nov 2013 17:51 by Lauris (Lauris).

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25 Nov 2013 18:36 - 25 Nov 2013 20:14 #66 by Lauris (Lauris)
this is heart breaking





actually after water change all plants are producing tonns of air
I still have hope they might pick up..but If I need to remove all
effected ones I will need to remove everything and start again.
looks like unstoppable, and hopeless pain on both sides of the glass..

would the photo period increase help?
or just keep doing my daily large amount water changes?

I know I should not be panicking, and I'm not..this just brakes my heart to bits.. pore plnts

I am planted!
Last edit: 25 Nov 2013 20:14 by Lauris (Lauris).

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25 Nov 2013 20:14 #67 by bmcg38 (Brian McGrath)
the tank looks fantastic .. just let it settle down for a few days . Where did yo get the wood from and do you know what type of wood it is ?

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25 Nov 2013 20:23 #68 by Lauris (Lauris)
It would be a blessing if this would just be resolved with settling down. My main concern is to keep plants alive till everything gets to normal. As cuba is tiny it may melt away within a week.

I'm not sure about type of wood. Got it from seahorse. Just took two best pieces to fit together. Darren might recognize the wood.

Thanks!

I am planted!

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25 Nov 2013 20:34 #69 by bmcg38 (Brian McGrath)

Lauris wrote:
I'm not sure about type of wood. Got it from seahorse. Just took two best pieces to fit together. Darren might recognize the wood.

Thanks!


that's good that you bought the wood from a shop , thought that maybe you had just found it and stuck it in there !

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26 Nov 2013 00:41 #70 by platty252 (Darren Dalton)
I don't know what happened yesterday with all the repeated posts?..........

Thanks for the pictures Lauris. I can see the plants are melting.
I also see a couple of strands of hair algae, so extra light wont help.

Ok so we know from your tests its not from excess nutrients (ammonia).

I haven't experienced this after a flood before but if I was in your shoes this is what I would try.

Take a big step back. Drain the tank and put it back in to dry start mode.
Let it dry out a bit to kill of any decaying leaves. These are just feeding of the good part of the plant.
The sooner these bad bits dry out and die the better.
It may take a couple of weeks to get back on track but you will get there.

This time I would use RO water for misting and add a very small amount of trace (micro nutrients) to the misting bottle. If you have some potassium add some as well.

If you try save it while flooded I think you will have no Cuba left within a week.
the tree can be moved to another tank. It will not effect the tank.
The wood comes in as moor wood (not red moor).

Next time you flood I would do the following.
Day 1 of flood fill the tank just enough to cover the plants for 1-2 hours and drain.
I would just use airline with a valve on the end to slowly drain the tank.
Day 2 repeat but cover the plants for 2-3 hours.
Keep doing this and increasing the time the plants are submersed each time. This may let them adapt to under water better.
If at any time they show signs of melting go back to dry start for a couple of days before trying again.

As I said this is a new one to me so I would brows the net to see if you can find anyone who had a similar problem and how they resolved it.
There are a couple of people on here who know plants better than me so maybe they might read your tread and throw in there 2 cents.

For the moment you should sit back and crack open a bottle of treveta for yourself.
All is not lost, just delayed.

Darren.

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26 Nov 2013 09:49 #71 by Lauris (Lauris)
All goog Darren!
You just confirmed and reasured me to do this.
I will drain it today. I have potassium and trece elemens so I will make a mix to benefit the plants in recovery process.

On UKAPS there is no reply on similar post so I will go ahead with your advice and we will se if I (we) can fix it this way.
Thanks!

I am planted!

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26 Nov 2013 10:29 #72 by bmcg38 (Brian McGrath)
i will be all worth it ion the end , its going to be a superb tank .

what fish are you thinking of ?

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26 Nov 2013 18:32 #73 by Lauris (Lauris)

bmcg38 wrote: i will be all worth it ion the end , its going to be a superb tank .

what fish are you thinking of ?


I'm thinking about adding 20 or 25 rummy noses on the top of my 20.

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26 Nov 2013 18:44 - 26 Nov 2013 19:21 #74 by Lauris (Lauris)
Ok. So tank is drained. I'm back to the point I
was just only with damaged plants. Will leave the
lights on again to 12-13 hours. Today wont wrap it
and will leave for the evening with lid partly
open so it may dry a bit quicker. I hope the
recovery process will be successfull.



In the mean time my 25L tank is facing a fancy
temporary upgrade. Powered with eheim 2213 (440l/h) + JBL 1501 (1400 l/h). lol.
Will see if my live stock (20rummys, pair of dwars
and 3amano will feel OK in this stream. I hope it
will do a lil job to build up a bit more bacteria
as it has now while I'm trying to save plants in
my new project.



So far rummys are quite happy and pair of dwarfs
does not look too confused as well.. but they sill
have a places to hide from stream because of the
driftwood.

I am planted!
Last edit: 26 Nov 2013 19:21 by Lauris (Lauris).

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27 Nov 2013 00:36 #75 by platty252 (Darren Dalton)

Lauris wrote: On UKAPS there is no reply on similar post


I would send them a PM. May be they solved the problem and never up dated the post.
If that doesn't work I would send one of there long term members a brief PM. Just ask to be pointed in the right direction for help. Try Ghostword, James star marshell, George farmer ......
Just don't say I sent you :laugh:

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02 Dec 2013 22:55 #76 by pit (Piotr Urbanski)
Hi,
how does it look now?

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02 Dec 2013 23:33 - 02 Dec 2013 23:39 #77 by Lauris (Lauris)
Hi pit! Thanks for asking. It is completely drained now.
Drained the tank last week as updated. 1st 4 days didn't spray a single time. Turned lights ON for 13 hours a day
Sunday started to spray with RO+trece elements.
No major losses on Cuba just few damaged sections. Cuba is feeling much better now. Nice green colour is back on.
Keeps forming as a carpet. Still has a signs of damage but does
not look as hopeless as it was. Glosso is not too bad as well.
Lost a bit of it but it's still taking over the stones and keeps growing. Today performed a cut-off to the dried parts of it.
The process was like a real surgery. lol.
Looks like this all will survive.(happy days)

I'll wait for another week to let it recover and will do some photo update.

This time I will take my time and will wait till I'll be sure
I can flood it and do it in proper way with draining it everyday and increasing the time of tank flooded slowly
every day to make sure I'll addapt them properly when changing enviroment.

I am planted!
Last edit: 02 Dec 2013 23:39 by Lauris (Lauris).

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03 Dec 2013 12:22 - 03 Dec 2013 12:24 #78 by pit (Piotr Urbanski)
That's good:) i hope that this time every think will be ok. Don't forget about photo update.
Yesterday i found a little bit simmilar scape on polish forum scontent-a-cdg.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2...596_1665631262_n.jpg
looks good too
Last edit: 03 Dec 2013 12:24 by pit (Piotr Urbanski).

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06 Dec 2013 19:39 - 06 Dec 2013 19:56 #79 by Lauris (Lauris)
Ok. So another update. Looks like I managed (with help and advice of almighty Darren)
to save my project. The worst is behind and now it looks much better as even before
the flooding (except some few areas of what's left over from damage).

So far of what I'm doing:
Lights:
Added additional 28w tube. So now I'm lighting this box up with 3x28w+1x34w for 12 hours
Around 6 hours it does deliver the full power available, 3hours 2 x 28w with higher K rate
in the morning and 3 hours of 1x34w+1x28w lover K rate before shutting down. Looks like
plants does not mind and only benefit from the amount of light delivered.
Spraying:
2 days with RO + Chelated Trace Elements
2 days with RO + Potassium Nitrate, Potassium Phosphate, Magnesium Sulphate


Cuba carpet is getting really tight in some places what looks really well.
As in background picture you can really notice how well thick it is now.
Two smaller pictures reflect the worst effected areas (that's what is left over
from melting)



This is how it looks from top right now. Different areas of my project. The colour of Cuba
now is really juicy strong green! Glosso is stretching out over the stones.
I'm trying to form the runners on stones every 2-3 days and they are really stick to the rock. If it will
go well I will try to form it in a curtain over the big cave rock. This should look very nice especially
when glosso will be not floating but attached to the rock all over.


I think it will take its time to fill some spots as you can see from a top-side view there are some spots
much slower growth (don't mind the big gap to the far side (in pic.) as this is the hole for tree to go back.


And a face view..


..as more I'm looking at the scape now as more I'm having a doubts about the tree..
I dunno if I would like to see it going back in th form and way it looks itself with moss..
but what I'm thinking of is just a tree with a very few branches, much less massive as the
one I have.. with no moss, but maybe some Bonsai Anubias.. or even without anything, just
a "dead" tree to add for the scape more rough feeling of loneliness..
But then I will need to change the project name.. lol

I am planted!
Last edit: 06 Dec 2013 19:56 by Lauris (Lauris).

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06 Dec 2013 22:04 #80 by blade (Michael G)
Its coming along nicely fair play to you , Patience is the key , good flow is also very important i find.

Good luck with it

Michael

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06 Dec 2013 22:16 - 06 Dec 2013 22:17 #81 by Lauris (Lauris)
Thanks Michael. I think I should not be worried about flow as JBL e1501 on 125L tank will deliver quite optimal results.
It was my fault I lost the patience. I've got my lesson well. It's all good what ends good. I'll take this as experiance to avoid this in future and share with others if needed. Thanks.

I am planted!
Last edit: 06 Dec 2013 22:17 by Lauris (Lauris).

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07 Dec 2013 02:05 #82 by platty252 (Darren Dalton)
Its interesting how the Glosso is attaching to the rock. I tried this and it didn't work out for me.
Maybe ill try it again some day.

It's nearly flood time again. :lol:

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07 Dec 2013 09:54 - 07 Dec 2013 09:55 #83 by Lauris (Lauris)

platty252 wrote:
It's nearly flood time again. :lol:


Can I leave it dry? Less problems and easy to maintain. :laugh:

I am planted!
Last edit: 07 Dec 2013 09:55 by Lauris (Lauris).

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14 Dec 2013 12:30 #84 by Condorave (Daniel O'Connor)

platty252 wrote: I could be wrong but I think you have two different issues here.

On the tree/wood it looks like a fungus. you can get if the wood was not completely dry to start with.
It is impossible to tell when buying wood if it is completely dry.
If it is a fungus it will go away soon and is completely harmless.
Another possibility is a bacteria that looks like spider cobwebs and can slowly move. Again harmless.

I think with the plants it is a separate issue.
They are possibly melting after the transition from immersed to submersed. Not common with HC Cuba.
They could be melting from high nutrient levels in the form of Ammonia/Ammonium.
This is why I suggested emptying after the first flood and refilling. I wonder if it got rid of enough excess nutrients?

When new Amazonia first came out I did a large tank with 20 pots of HC. added 2 large mature externals and lost it all within a couple of days. It looked like yours dose now.
The Ammonia level was off the scale. After a 80% water change it was still off the scale.

When I dry start a tank I do so for 4 weeks and don't have issues with ammonia. Even if I add a new filter.

I would try get the Ammonia tested.
I would also do a large water change every couple of days. Just in case.

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14 Dec 2013 12:36 #85 by Condorave (Daniel O'Connor)
Hello platty252,

Sorry im new to forum and how it works.

In the message above you say the plants are possibly melting.

What do you mean by that?

Condorave

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15 Dec 2013 01:40 #86 by platty252 (Darren Dalton)
Hello Condorave and welcome to the forum.

When I say possibly melting I mean they actually look like they are melting. Like butter on a hot pan.
The plant just dies and can do it quickly.
It can be from a number of things like environmental changes. immersed to submersed growth.

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15 Dec 2013 10:09 #87 by Lauris (Lauris)
Hi everyone!
Just a quick update..
I'm liking this tree more and more. In my little set-up it starts to deliver results
expected. Branches with moss starting to fill out nicely and form very thick and bushy..
It may look much better in the scape when the moss will take over :)

month ago -


today -


treating with:
Micro and macro nutrients evry other day daily - 4ml per day
Easy carbo - 3ml daily
Light unit - table lamp 25w, 10hrs daily

Iwagumi still filling out nicely.. Cuba recovered, Glosso feels well.
The only reason I'm not flooding it yet - I'm waiting till the Glosso
will cover more of the stones. I do believe, once tank will be flooded
with my filtration delivered Glosso won't have a chance to attach to the rock

I am planted!

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15 Dec 2013 13:18 #88 by Condorave (Daniel O'Connor)
Thanks platty252.

just had never heard of it before.

Condorave

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15 Dec 2013 16:33 #89 by paulv (paul vickers)
Love the way the rummy nose follow the contours of the substrate, very cool looking :cool:

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18 Dec 2013 18:52 - 18 Dec 2013 18:53 #90 by Lauris (Lauris)

platty252 wrote:
It's nearly flood time again. :lol:


me loosing patience.. again.. lol

I am planted!
Last edit: 18 Dec 2013 18:53 by Lauris (Lauris).

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